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Running Rich

5oh

Two Tone One Mustang
Not sure if this was the right section for this. I apologize in advance.

I recently got my hands on a 1989 Mustang GT FOR A GREAT PRICE. So I couldn't pass up this. I was aware of the problem. Because it smokes black. The owner was unaware.

The car starts up funny. But it starts mostly every time. When I first got it and went to start it for the first time it didn't. I was told by the previous owner to try starting it while pressing the gas (I don't have to do this all the time) and it started after a bit, but kind of hesitant at first like the motor is slightly bogging. It idles decent. There is small humming but barley noticeable. It idles at 700-750. But the motor shakes the car a bit and seems like its struggling. I don't think I have any misfiring. There is no popping or backfiring. And the throttle response is good. It picks up and goes but I've noticed on deceleration the car seems to buck once or twice before it down shifts. (Not all the time) when I'm in the last gear at very low rpms and the tranny hasn't down shifted yet I give it gas to speed up and it's slow at first but when I give it more gas it picks up shortly after. There is a check engine light on. I have only replaced the starter and solenoid and negative ground battery wire.

I got the codes checked out by a shop (with a A+ bbb) but they are just general mechanics. They told me the codes read that I needed a Barometric pressure sensor, EGR Valve Position Sensor, and a Mass Air Flow sensor. I know one sensor can trigger others. But I bought all three new from LateModelResto anyways. I have never messed with check engine lights or sensors before. I don't know the exact codes. I decided to try this myself because the shop wanted 738$ for parts and labor for those three. ::

I drove my car home and disconnected the neg. battery cable because I was going to start with the barometric sensor as advised from a friend. But I noticed the EGR Valve connector wasn't plugged into the EGR valve position sensor like it should be. I don't know how long that was like that either before the shop or after. So I plugged it in and replaced the barometric sensor only and the battery was unplugged for a good hour so I hooked it back up and still saw the check engine light on and the smoking etc. so I decided to drive it around for 15-20 minutes and still no change. I also put another mass air flow off a running car (89 too) with no check engine and still no change. I haven't pulled the plugs yet. But I'm sure they are fouled out.


I'm tired of the gas smell when I drive it and the black smoke and the horrible gas milage.

Should I go ahead and replace the other sensors?
Can timing cause this?
Any advice is appreciated.
 

wickedstangs

Chula Vista, CA
Staff member
Administrator
Not sure if this was the right section for this. I apologize in advance.

I recently got my hands on a 1989 Mustang GT FOR A GREAT PRICE. So I couldn't pass up this. I was aware of the problem. Because it smokes black. The owner was unaware.

The car starts up funny. But it starts mostly every time. When I first got it and went to start it for the first time it didn't. I was told by the previous owner to try starting it while pressing the gas (I don't have to do this all the time) and it started after a bit, but kind of hesitant at first like the motor is slightly bogging. It idles decent. There is small humming but barley noticeable. It idles at 700-750. But the motor shakes the car a bit and seems like its struggling. I don't think I have any misfiring. There is no popping or backfiring. And the throttle response is good. It picks up and goes but I've noticed on deceleration the car seems to buck once or twice before it down shifts. (Not all the time) when I'm in the last gear at very low rpms and the tranny hasn't down shifted yet I give it gas to speed up and it's slow at first but when I give it more gas it picks up shortly after. There is a check engine light on. I have only replaced the starter and solenoid and negative ground battery wire.

I got the codes checked out by a shop (with a A+ bbb) but they are just general mechanics. They told me the codes read that I needed a Barometric pressure sensor, EGR Valve Position Sensor, and a Mass Air Flow sensor. I know one sensor can trigger others. But I bought all three new from LateModelResto anyways. I have never messed with check engine lights or sensors before. I don't know the exact codes. I decided to try this myself because the shop wanted 738$ for parts and labor for those three. ::

I drove my car home and disconnected the neg. battery cable because I was going to start with the barometric sensor as advised from a friend. But I noticed the EGR Valve connector wasn't plugged into the EGR valve position sensor like it should be. I don't know how long that was like that either before the shop or after. So I plugged it in and replaced the barometric sensor only and the battery was unplugged for a good hour so I hooked it back up and still saw the check engine light on and the smoking etc. so I decided to drive it around for 15-20 minutes and still no change. I also put another mass air flow off a running car (89 too) with no check engine and still no change. I haven't pulled the plugs yet. But I'm sure they are fouled out.


I'm tired of the gas smell when I drive it and the black smoke and the horrible gas milage.

Should I go ahead and replace the other sensors?
Can timing cause this?
Any advice is appreciated.
Please post up the Codes so we can help you...
 

wickedstangs

Chula Vista, CA
Staff member
Administrator

5oh

Two Tone One Mustang
wrong answer :) I need the code to help you fix your issues...

Go to your local Autozone or Oreilly's and get a EEC-IV code reader like below.. Very easy to use.. And should be under 25.00
View attachment 6624


Amazon has them for 24.99
http://www.amazon.com/INNOVA-3145-Ford-Digital-Reader/dp/B000EW0KHW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1400523776&sr=8-1&keywords=ford obd1 scanner
On the key of engine off test I got a code 19 & 31

Then the separator code of 10

Then a 91
 

5oh

Two Tone One Mustang
wrong answer :) I need the code to help you fix your issues...

Go to your local Autozone or Oreilly's and get a EEC-IV code reader like below.. Very easy to use.. And should be under 25.00
View attachment 6624


Amazon has them for 24.99
http://www.amazon.com/INNOVA-3145-Ford-Digital-Reader/dp/B000EW0KHW/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1400523776&sr=8-1&keywords=ford obd1 scanner
CORRECTION:

On the key of engine off test I got a code 19 O

Then the separator code of 10

Then a code 31 C , 91 C
 

wickedstangs

Chula Vista, CA
Staff member
Administrator
CORRECTION:

On the key of engine off test I got a code 19 O

Then the separator code of 10

Then a code 31 C , 91 C
Make sure to test again.. Code 19 is not good on KOEO test and by your symptoms you running rich and code 19 should not be happening.. Can you please check it one more time.. Also your separator code is 1 not 10 :)
 

5oh

Two Tone One Mustang
Make sure to test again.. Code 19 is not good on KOEO test and by your symptoms you running rich and code 19 should not be happening.. Can you please check it one more time.. Also your separator code is 1 not 10 :)
Okay I did it again.

This time I got :

19 O, 31 O

Separation code

31 C, 91 C
 

wickedstangs

Chula Vista, CA
Staff member
Administrator
Okay I did it again.

This time I got :

19 O, 31 O

Separation code

31 C, 91 C
Have you replace the EGR? You said it was disconnected?
31 - EGR Valve Position/Pressure Feedback EGR Circuit Below Minimum Voltage. 0.24 volts (O,M,R)
 
Last edited:

sdsubzero4

Spring Valley, CA
Waiting for a EGR valve to come in from LMR. Should be here tomorrow. I'll keep you guys updated. So what about the code 19?
Code 19 - Engine off - No Vehicle Power (pins 37 + 57) or bad PCM VPWR Diagnosis. This is a wiring problem that is from a bad ECC power relay, bad connection, bad fuse link or a bad computer. The ECC relay is located on top of the computer under the passenger side kick panel. Pull the connector off any fuel injector and measure the voltage on the red wire: if its 12 volts or better, the ECC relay is OK. If the ECC relay is OK, pull the kick panel off and measure the voltage at pins 37 & 57. If it is 12 volts or more, then the computer's diagnostic firmware has taken a dump and is defective.
Engine running - Erratic idle during test (reset throttle & retest) - Idle Set Procedures
 

wickedstangs

Chula Vista, CA
Staff member
Administrator
Code 19 - Engine off - No Vehicle Power (pins 37 + 57) or bad PCM VPWR Diagnosis. This is a wiring problem that is from a bad ECC power relay, bad connection, bad fuse link or a bad computer. The ECC relay is located on top of the computer under the passenger side kick panel. Pull the connector off any fuel injector and measure the voltage on the red wire: if its 12 volts or better, the ECC relay is OK. If the ECC relay is OK, pull the kick panel off and measure the voltage at pins 37 & 57. If it is 12 volts or more, then the computer's diagnostic firmware has taken a dump and is defective.
Engine running - Erratic idle during test (reset throttle & retest) - Idle Set Procedures
Yeah Danny that is why I posted he does not have this code... The car would not be running with a KOEO Test code 19..
 

5oh

Two Tone One Mustang
Yeah Danny that is why I posted he does not have this code... The car would not be running with a KOEO Test code 19..
Okay so I replaced the EGR valve and the EGR valve position sensor and gasket. When I hooked up the battery and started the car the check engine light was gone!!!! (first time since I've had it) so I decided to take it for a spin (15-20 minutes worth) I noticed the bad smell was gone. Idle is low and boggy sounding still. And I'm sure it's running rich still too. When I was almost home the check engine light came back on :( about to go run the codes now. Check back in a bit
 
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